Bram on an accessible workplace when you're blind: “Don't assume things can't be done, just start.”
Since the end of 2023, Bram Duvigneau has joined the Swink team. Or actually we got two more colleagues, because service dog Mellow joins him cozily to the Swink office in Amsterdam Sloterdijk. In addition to being a highly experienced digital accessibility specialist, Bram is also blind. He doesn't let that stop him. On the contrary. For example, he travels by public transport and regularly works at clients' offices, where Mellow is a familiar face.
You are a digital accessibility specialist. What exactly does your job entail?
“I sometimes jokingly say that I get involved in everything within Swink when it comes to digital accessibility. I support technically complex research, supervise advisory projects for our clients and also work a lot internally on strategy and training our colleagues.”
You have diverse work: conducting research, advising clients, giving presentations and working on location. Would you say you don't let being blind hold you back?
“I guess you could say that. Of course there are things that are not (yet) practical as a blind person, such as driving a car, but if anything is at all possible, I have never let being blind stop me. When I go to a new client I plan my trip by public transport like everyone else. If the last bit is walking I use the navigation on my phone. If I really want to be sure it will be okay and it looks complicated, such as a very busy road or a large business park, I sometimes take a cab for the last bit. Then I'm sure I'll be dropped off neatly at the door.”
What tools do you use to do your job well? For example, do you use a screen reader, a software program that reads aloud what's on the screen with a computerized voice?
“I use a screen reader on all my devices like on my laptop, otherwise I wouldn't be able to work with it because I can't read the information on it. Fortunately, that is a built-in option on smartphones these days. I remember that for my first Nokia smartphone I still had to buy separate software, which cost a few hundred euros on top of this already expensive phone at the time. On my Windows laptop, on which I usually work, I use NVDA (Non-Visual Desktop Access). That's a free screen reader developed by two blind programmers.
For my work, I also use other screen readers such as JAWS and VoiceOver on a Mac, but that is mainly to test things in accessibility surveys for our clients. I also use a Braille reader, a device that allows me to read text on the computer screen in Braille. Especially when I'm working with code, it comes in handy; reading is more pleasant than listening to a computer voice. Checking what is written and whether all the brackets, quotation marks, etc. are correct is faster by reading it in Braille.
Recently, AI developments have also been very interesting. For example, I regularly run an image through ChatGPT for a description of it, and I sometimes use AI-generated voices to have ebooks read to me. After all, they sound better than computer voices. Of course, this is all still in its infancy and I am conscious of what I do or do not share with these types of services. Hopefully in a few years we will be able to run this kind of software on our laptops and phones and better tailor the models to our personal needs.”
What function does your service dog Mellow serve for you? What can he help you with?
“He is a guide dog for the blind; guides me around obstacles and alerts me to things like stairs. He can also look for certain things, such as doors, public transport gates or a free seat. Many people think that a guide dog also knows the way, but this is not so. I have to direct him with commands like “left” and “right.” If I don't do that and I let him decide where we're going, I'll probably end up in a loose-leash forest somewhere.”
What do you do to function well? For example, do you proactively ask for what you need?
“I work a lot with different clients. Then it is always a matter of waiting to see what systems you encounter and whether they are accessible. I cannot do an assignment if a system is not usable for me and it is a short-term assignment. Then it is sometimes not worth working around it. I always discuss the content of an assignment with the client first if I am going to work actually and expect problems. Then I ask about what systems I need. Usually there is no problem, nor do I want clients to see unnecessary bears on the road. I also never announce that I am coming with a guide dog; I don't think that should be a problem. For (future) clients who read this, feel free to prepare a bowl of water.”
What reactions do you get from colleagues and clients to being blind? How do you deal with that?
“In my daily work, I get very few reactions to it. The people I work with are used to it. Working with me is actually just like working with other colleagues. I may sometimes ask for a link/copy of a file when people show something via screen sharing in an online meeting, because that's not readable to me. Some colleagues are now aware of this and send presentations or work files in advance, which is nice. New clients do sometimes react with surprise that I'm blind, but that's generally over quickly when they find that I can do the job just fine. There are also clients for whom I have only worked remotely and who probably don't even know that I am blind. That sometimes creates fun situations, such as the question, “Do we need to create a description for this picture?”.
Have you made arrangements within Swink about how you can do your job well?
“I don't live close to the Swink office and work a lot from home to avoid unnecessary travel time. Fortunately, this is possible by mutual agreement. Unfortunately, not all Swink systems are accessible. This is known. For example, my colleagues know that I cannot see the schedule and that they should give me a call if there is something important in it.”
When is a workplace accessible for you?
“For me it is important that a workplace is easily accessible by public transport. I don't mind walking a bit, but cycling is out of the question for me. Of course I can take a cab, but apart from the cost, it is sometimes a problem that drivers who don't like dogs very much don't want to take me and my dog.
In the workplace itself I am not so demanding; a comfortable chair and a table with power and internet for my laptop and I can get to work. After all, I have no use for big screens. When I work for a large organization, I do hate flexible workstations. You have to figure out where your team is sitting and if there is still room.
An increasing problem in workplaces is touchscreens. For the coffee machine or the elevator, for example. I always ask colleagues to get coffee then, even though I find it annoying. But without the necessary shots in a day I don't make it to the end of the working day. :)”
What would you advise employers on how to create an accessible workplace for people with disabilities?
“I think people with disabilities are used to pushing a little harder than others to achieve something. Nevertheless, a lot of them are still sitting at home and that's a real shame. Of course, many larger companies have special tracks for this target group. They are hired more quickly, even when there is no vacancy. And they often go through a different application process. I have mixed feelings about that. If I apply somewhere or am hired by a client for a job, I want to be sought out for my knowledge and skills. And not to meet a quota. On the other hand, unemployment among people with disabilities does indicate that something must be done to get more people in this group into work. Therefore, do not immediately assume that things cannot be done, but just start and then see what does or does not work.”
